6.0.2 Release Candidate

[JayF]

Just wanted to make a quick post in the main QCharts forum that we have posted a possible release candidate for the last 6.0 version (6.0.2). If you haven't already downloaded 6.0.1.11, we encourage you to head over to the Beta forum and grab your early copy of 6.0.2 today.

Please click here to go to that post.

[WhoLovesYa]

6.0.2

And it still sucks!

I got your e-mail last night and downloaded the new version. Plugged in my current workspace I use in 5.1 and it looked ok. As soon as the market opened ( and I mean to the second) my cpu pegged 100% and the program froze. After taking about 10 minutes to close the program, opened up 5.1 and checked cpu, which was about 30-40%.

Later in the morning around 11:30 closed down 5.1 and and opened 6.0.2 up. Again pegged cpu right to 100%. Started closing down symbols till I got to about 130. It stopped freezing but was still running between 70-100% cpu.

Closed it again and opened up the 5.1 ( you know, the one with 2 - 3 x the symbols) no problem. ( well not really no problem 1/2 the data is slow or stale and cant trust the short interest, vol, ticks, shares OS, Market cap, float etc etc) Still running 30-40% cpu so I guess its better then what your about to force me to use.

Why do I use your product again?

I guess I'm April's fool!

Who

[tradertom]

Hey Who,

I too have that problem with the most recent versions but since I seemed to be the only one, I feel I was considered an outlier and therefore it was deemed more important to put out a release candidate version I cannot use it that others were applauding. Not that I am happy that you are having problems, but it is nice to see that someone else here experienced the same symptom I did with that version. I share your pain.

In fairness, I tried some things with Mike and Jay and others to try and figure it out, but frankly, I would rather just trade than to spend all day rebooting my frozen computer during market hours and seeking technical workarounds for their programming problems. I have a new model quad core intel with 3GB ram. I couldn't even use task manager when it froze; I had to physically press the power button. It seemed to work well during off-hours but as with you, the second (exact second) the bell rang on CNBC, the whole computer freezes. No white-out, just 100% CPU utilization and no ability to do anything.

I would like to believe that the eSignal guys can figure out why this is happening and fix it. I cannot believe this problem will be limited to only two users...

Tom

[WhoLovesYa]

Originally posted by tradertom

I would like to believe that the eSignal guys can figure out why this is happening and fix it. I cannot believe this problem will be limited to only two users...

Keep on believing. We are not the only ones.

I'm pretty sure someone soon will post its all our systems fault because they are running blah, blah, blah, blah blah and it works just fine.

Most companies under promise and over deliver. Qcharts since its inception has always over promised and under delivered. Doesnt matter who happens to own/run it at the time.

Who

[Larry Marchman]

Originally posted by tradertom
<snip>....I cannot believe this problem will be limited to only two users...
Tom

LOL. Hardly.

Did you not notice my posts(that's plural) along the way regarding my inability to run my "production 5.1" workspace in 6.0? And the same goes with 6.0.2, notwithstanding it's performance improvements. And in my case, my 5.1 workspace is designed to run OK on a "tick equivalent" feed.

Remember Carol's exhaustive report comparing 5.1 and 6.0, including tick equivalent metrics? The report was true and accurate. I know this to be so since I was involved behind the scenes in it's creation.

Many folks have posted. But once or twice or thrice so reported, they, like I methinks just step back, waiting.

So, don't know where you got the impression you were like hanging out there twisting in the wind by yourself. That's hardly the case. You ain't home alone.

LAM

[Larry Marchman]

Originally posted by WhoLovesYa

I'm pretty sure someone soon will post its all our systems fault because they are running blah, blah, blah, blah blah and it works just fine.
Who

ROTFLMAO. You made my day. Priceless.

LAM

[tradertom]

Hey Larry,

Thanks for the comfort (if having others in my boat is comfort!?!) I do recall the many posts regarding problems with version 6.x but my specific problem of freezing during market hours seemed to be unique to me and only with the candidate version. Carol got the WSOD as I recall; I never get that. She was able to use it during market hours for a few days at least but in my case, I could not. It just stops updating when the opening bell rings and the computer becomes catatonic. Not slowed down. Just stopped. Hard to measure performance improvement all four processor cores are locked! Oddly 6.0.1.10 didn't give me this problem, but 6.0.1.11 (release candidate) did. eSig folks told me the changes between x10 and x11 would not cause this. Even though I could replicate easily on my machine, no one else on the beta list seemed to be totally locked down but me and I felt as if I was alone with this particular problem.

Some helpful folks (yourself, Bill and Mike deserve thanks here) tried to help but it was fruitless. I was missing trades messing about with all the stuff I was trying just to get the software to work.

For me, this version is a total showstopper. Not just a nuisance. Not missing ticks or duplicated candles or blank charts or quote sheets that don't update or bad ticks or any of the other problems that we all must endure. For me, this candidate version means I have to continue to use a beta version until (or if) they ever get a version that will work on my machine, or I will have to find another vendor and move into a new charting package. All because the improved program would not run during market hours on my new speedy computer.

I do not mean to imply that the candidate version worked splendidly on everyone's machine except mine; just that WhoLovesYa's problem sounded just like my problem and that was oddly comforting!

Cheers,
Tom

[JayF]

Tom,

We certainly do know about and admit that their continue to be performance problems with 6.0.2 especially during times when large amounts of streaming data are flowing into the product. We seen this inhouse and are actively profiling the causes of these issues. As mentioned in the recent email that I sent to all users we are rededicating ourselves to getting to the bottom of these performance issues. Simply put, that is our number 1 priority for QCharts.

Something strange though is still not sitting right with me and that is, how.6.0.1.10 is working ok for you, but 6.0.2 does not. I believe Bill was able to run your workspace ok on 6.0.2, which leads me to something interesting that Mike and I discussed this last Monday. When we first looked at the code differences there was very little between the two... And when you first repored that 6.0.1.11 didn't work for you on the beta forum we were quite stumped as we couldn't duplicate the issues even on less powerful systems with similar workspaces.

When comparing the size of the two installers I noticed that 6.0.2 was about 200-400kb bigger (working from memory here and on my BlackBerry.) When Mike explained that he switched to using an upgraded version of Visual Studio to compile 6.0.2 and that additonal files were being included. It made me think that some possible issues may have arisen, not in the code itself but perhaps in compatibility with certain high-end processors.

I'll work with my engineers on this to see if we can sniff this out, and I'll try to get my hands on a Quad core system for further testing. If you could PM me with your exact System Information that would be helpful to more accurately line-up possible test PC's.

I don't want to say the ole... It's yer PC. It's not. But there maybe something in QCharts 6.0.2 that is making the performance worsen for Quad-core Intel's. Just a theory.... For now.

Originally posted by tradertom
Hey Who,

I too have that problem with the most recent versions but since I seemed to be the only one, I feel I was considered an outlier and therefore it was deemed more important to put out a release candidate version I cannot use it that others were applauding. Not that I am happy that you are having problems, but it is nice to see that someone else here experienced the same symptom I did with that version. I share your pain.

In fairness, I tried some things with Mike and Jay and others to try and figure it out, but frankly, I would rather just trade than to spend all day rebooting my frozen computer during market hours and seeking technical workarounds for their programming problems. I have a new model quad core intel with 3GB ram. I couldn't even use task manager when it froze; I had to physically press the power button. It seemed to work well during off-hours but as with you, the second (exact second) the bell rang on CNBC, the whole computer freezes. No white-out, just 100% CPU utilization and no ability to do anything.

I would like to believe that the eSignal guys can figure out why this is happening and fix it. I cannot believe this problem will be limited to only two users...

Tom

[WhoLovesYa]

Originally posted by JayF
It made me think that some possible issues may have arisen, not in the code itself but perhaps in compatibility with certain high-end processors.

I'll work with my engineers on this to see if we can sniff this out, and I'll try to get my hands on a Quad core system for further testing. If you could PM me with your exact System Information that would be helpful to more accurately line-up possible test PC's.

I don't want to say the ole... It's yer PC. It's not. But there maybe something in QCharts 6.0.2 that is making the performance worsen for Quad-core Intel's. Just a theory.... For now. [/B]

Well let me blow that theory out of the water.

I don't run a high end system. My thinking goes like this. Why do I need to go out and buy a 1K+ system to run a program that is essentially giving me less data? 5.1 works on my system 6.0 should work on my system. I know that some of the data is "throttled" backwith 5.1 , but with 6.0 you are limiting me to 200 symbols - essentially because I'm one of the data hogs.

My computer meets your specs for working above what is recommeded, yet it does not.

I run a 2.26 GHz Pentium 4 with 1 GB RAM on a 6MB dsl line with MS explorer 6.0

Who

[WhoLovesYa]

Originally posted by Larry Marchman
ROTFLMAO. You made my day. Priceless.

LAM

Larry,

Glad I could get a smile out of you. I don't come around here very often. I do notice when I do that you have always tried to help others out.

For a while thought maybe you should just go work for them since you seemed to be able to tell them what most of the problems were/are. Its very telling that you are having problems and issues and they aren't being addressed/fixed.

What kills me at this point is I understand going back to 6.0 to fix some problems before moving on to 6.1, but releasing a version of 6.0.2 with the same problem does nothing for me or you or the countless others. What was the point? "See look we are trying!"

I got all my hopes up that it was going to work better only to have an april fools joke played on me. Not to mention - the only way to see if it works is during market hours. Nothing like having a volitile market and a frozen charting program. Fantastic way to start the quarter!

Who

[ckelly]

Just a gentle reminder / fyi for all users of 6.0 - be aware that any double/multiple of 4 minutes will give you very different data than all other time frames. That is, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128 minutes, etc. will display the data erroneously.

fyi,
Carol

[JayF]

Originally posted by WhoLovesYa
Well let me blow that theory out of the water. ...
I run a 2.26 GHz Pentium 4 with 1 GB RAM on a 6MB dsl line with MS explorer 6.0

Who

Who,

That doesn't blow my theory out of the water. What you describe is what we do know about with QCharts 6.0.2. I have a 3.2Ghz P4 at home with a 1Gb of RAM and I can see the problems you describe when running a medium to large workspace. We have a good grasp on what is causing this, but its not an overnight fix.... there are many layers to this issue hidden beneath the veil of the eSigniumClient and Emanager code. Quad cores in theory should be able to handle what QCharts 6.0.2 is throwing at it and Tom was running fine on an earlier beta, so logic says there's something strange happening between that beta and now.

It still sounds like you have the question, why did we release it if we knew we had problems? Some certainly disagree with my/our decision on releasing this version, but my feeling is that while there are certainly some inefficiencies in the 6.x version, some that are only tracking a modest number of symbols (i.e. an ES only trader) are not experiencing the melt-downs that others are seeing.

In fact, as mentioned I can run a large workspace with ~350 active symbols and 14 heavily loaded charts on my laptop that has a relatively new processor (Intel Core Duo @2Ghz w/ 2Gb RAM.) Even on that PC though I can get QCharts to melt down after cycling through about 50-60 symbols (that's about 700 charts in cache; another area that needs immediate work.)

Despite that... we don't expect everyone to run out and buy a new PC to continue to run QCharts. We have every intention on keeping 5.1 running for as long as we need to in order to get QCharts 6.x where it needs to be.

[mfr]

The way it looks to me Esignal has acknowledged the aforementioned problems. At least they didn't phase out the working version 5.1 and told everyone to get on 6 immediately.
5.1 is working just fine and I am happy with it. If it were up to me I'd never leave 5.1 (just a few enhancements maybe).
If 6 is causing such headache why not stick with 5.1 until they have worked out the kinks?

[WhoLovesYa]

Originally posted by JayF
Who,

some that are only tracking a modest number of symbols (i.e. an ES only trader) are not experiencing the melt-downs that others are seeing.

Despite that... we don't expect everyone to run out and buy a new PC to continue to run QCharts. We have every intention on keeping 5.1 running for as long as we need to in order to get QCharts 6.x where it needs to be.

And THAT is the problem. For people who trade one future your new system works fine. But I look at qcharts to quickly scan the market. Looking for sectors or stocks breaking out. Just using the ES doesn't cut it for me and many other users.

And is far as 5.1 is concerned yes it works but stop acting like you are keeping it running - it is degrading and you and I both know it. You stopped updating things like Short Interest well over a year ago. The OS, float, Institutional owned, book value, cash flow etc etc etc are either way behind or just aren't updated anymore either. Bad ticks stay in charts making those charts useless. Some futures (which I don't trade) if there is problem with feed and missing data - to bad we can't spend the time to go back and fix it.

Lets face some facts; you have too many balls in the air. How do you keep and old system running while you work the bugs out of now 2 different versions of an update? You can't and it shows. Yet, what I pay you for the diminishing system you currently use and the useless one you are trying to use is still the same.

Stop defending what your doing and just get the damn thing fixed.

Who

[hardtaill]

Here's a WS with 11 charts, 10 porfolios, 388 symbols, T&S, Streaming News six chart studies and Single Quote. 6.0.2 During market hours. No options and charts come in pretty fast. I'm also running 5.1 at the same time.

6.0.2 actually runs faster than .10 and .11 and never crashes. What I need is more data fields in 6.0.2 that are only available in 5.1. I don't really like to run both apps, but throttled info is better than no info. I think the beta is coming along quite nicely.


Tail.