Getting Started

[Jthiel1004]

Scott,
I am new to futures trading and would like to explore trading the S&P eminis. My current broker does not accomodate futures, but I would like to find a service where I can open up an account and use Esignal to trade the eminis. Can you tell me where to get started?

Thank you
Joe

[its1111]

Hi Joe

I am sure this will fall on deaf ears but if I were you I would get some really good seminars under my belt before you start trading the eminis
The esingal goup has some very good seminars.
Everyone likes to think that they will open an account and be profitable but the eminis is a very hard vehicle to trade.
It has taken me 5 years and almost three hundered books and about ten seminars later and I finally am able to do it.
So make sure you have lots and lots of sudying under you belt before you do it, or you will get killed. I have seen lot of traders fail and then when they do they get depressed and quit, but try to remember that there are lots and lots of members on the floor that have learned how to take your money that have been doing this a long time. Study and you will be profitable, dont and you will loose.
hope this helps
Mark

[rmwtrader]

Hi Joe,

I agree with Mark. It took me almost three years to be successful. My steepest learning curve was dealing with the emotional aspect to trading; meaning to always take all the trades your system tells you to take without fear. You need to spend hundreds of hours watching the market because when market conditions changes on you, then you will be able to recognize the changes quicker and learn to adapt your system accordingly. Pay your dues, be patient, and you will succeed. AGAIN, You will save yourself a small fortune by being patient and learning as much as you can before you start real-time trading. Do not rely on back-testing. Use the FFastTrade simulator to try out your newly developed system.

God bless,
Bob

[hallahme]

Jthiel...and other traders in the making, including me,

What has helped me most in surviving thus far is listed below:

(1) Find and listen in for a long time (months, not days) to good chat rooms with proven records like my two favorites: "WoodiesCCIClub" (www.woodiescciclub.com) and eMiniWealth (www.eminiwealth.com). Familiarize yourself (through trial- or short-term subscriptions) with the likes of Divergence Software (www.sr-analyst.com), Neowave.com, Wave 59 (www.wave59.com), Ensign Software (www.ensignsoftware.com), Profitable Forecasting (www.profitableforecasting.com), and Astrological Software (www.stevenforrest.com). Don't overlook the offerings through such monster real-time quote purveyors such as eSignal (www.esignal.com) and TradeStation (www.tradestation.com). By the way, both these last-named provide superior ability to tailor your own trade systems with back-test capabilities.

(2) Attend seminars and read prolifically and widely...you will soon be able to smell the difference between the posturers and the truly adept.

(3) Overcome yourself: for instance, memorize Mark Douglas' "Trading in the Zone." Use Maxwell Maltz's "Psychocybernetics" to reprogram your mind.

Bottom line is to develop a system (how does 10,000 hours of effort sound?) or find someone who has a system that gives you an edge on the market, that can spell out with high probability what is coming. Then, paper trade that system, taking every trade (I know, I know...many say paper trading isn't even close to that which occurs when real money is on the line). Avoid systems that involve "too many" qualitative assessments.

Remember that money management is beyond critical. It is the very crux of survival. You do not need to know (nor can you know) absolutely what the market will do. You must know what you will do in any and every circumstance. The market is supremely beautiful and is always telling one what it will do. Being able to "see" or "hear" the message, as you undoubtedly know, is not always possible. Money management is what? Predefining one's exposure to risk, having a plan on how to scale out of multiple-position trades regardless of what the market will do.

By the way, IMHO, the easiest way to overcome overdependence on intellect, fear and self-loathing is to realize to your very bones that the market can do anything on the next tic. But a good edge plus unbreakable money-management rules will allow you to profit from the longer picture dictated by probability. Paraphrasing Douglas (mentioned above), Vegas doesn't know NOR DOES IT CARE what the next flip of the card will bring, the next toss of the dice. It KNOWS beyond the shadow of a doubt that, IN THE LONG RUN, probabliity dictates radical success.

One final note: a while ago, a brilliant man named "The Plumber" used to grace this site with copious analysis and comment. He is apparently gone...who can blame him. It gets lonesome when you're that good. If you come across minds such as that on your journey, stay quiet and listen. Don't ask stupid questions because brilliant people do not tolerate us fools gladly. I say "fools" not to insult anyone but as a reminder that there are people who operate on a different wavelength and should be respected, even if they may seem at times harsh in their reaction. Just listen to them, absorb. It's not that you will adopt even one tenth of what they do, but it deepens your awareness of the nature of the market's depth and complexity.

You do not have to be brilliant to succeed. You do have to be disciplined. You do have to have an edge (a system that gives high probability signals). You do have to use a money management approach. You do have to, as The Plumber once said, "Get over yourself."

Bright futures for us all,
Hal

[Jthiel1004]

Thank you All

Thank you all for commenting and sharing your knowledge, I did not expect to get such a supportive response. I promise all of you I will not dive in, I was just looking for a way to execute a very.. I mean a very small order when I felt comfortable. I have been investing and trading for about 4 years only in equities and every once and a while an option, but it seems that futures have the same type of leverage as options, except their pricing and movement is more pure. I currently have two trading coaches that have taught me a great deal, and I was looking to explore another type of market beyond just equities. I agree with you the psychology is a very important aspect to this game. One book I have enjoyed is Martin Pring's Investment Psychology Explained.....it is as eye opening as Trading in the Zone by Mark Douglas.

Thank you all very much.
Joe

[Anson]

Hi!

Risk management is extremely important. Too many ppl blow out their a/cs learning or fail to learn before they blow out.

This can be avoided by trading small and keeping exposure low. Use good risk to profit ratios like 1:2 or 1:3 targets in assesment before taking trades etc.

It took me almost 2 years to turn profitable. I could have been profitable before that with my methods but lacked the proper strength of mind. Psychological readiness is of absolute importance. I'm still working on improving my trading state of mind everyday.

Good luck and good journey to you!
Anson

[DuaneG]

Very well put Anson. IMHO, the money management aspect of trading should taught first, then the technical aspect. In my early trading days, it was the reverse and the learning curve was quite expensive. Thanks for sharing.

[jreijiri]

E-mini's Symbols

hi,
i used to trade e-mini's by selecting the contracts from a drop down list, and the funny part is i don't know the symbols... can anyone tell me what is the symbol of mini euro's ?

[ACM]

jreijiri
The symbol is ZE M5 for the current front month and ZE #F for the continuous contract
Alex

[jreijiri]

Thanks Alexis. Well I've been trying that symbol but i keep on getting "no data".
and if i want to trade EURO futures, which exchanges should i select and in your opinion, which esignal package is the most suitable for beginners in EURO futures trading ONLY?
Thanks again

[ACM]

jreijiri
Do you have a subscription to the CME emini package? If not that would explain why you are not receiving any data. Anyhow the data is available (see below the chart for the continuous contract)
As to your other questions you may want to redirect them to eSignal as they are in a better position to provide you with an answer
Alex